Presidential Election '08

[RedBedHead]

Any thought thus far as to who should be in the White House? Would love to hear your opinions! I'm having a really hard time this time around!

[ParagonEos]

I'm having a really hard time too, I am a conservative for the most part but it's anybody's game right now.

[Csara]

I just can't believe it's 2008 already. I remember waiting for this time to come 4 years ago. :nod:

[Sexy Strawberry]

The good news is that it can't get any worse than it already is...

[yonksgirl]

The good news is that it can't get any worse than it already is...

You got that right! LOL!!!!

I am torn between Obama and Gasp...Clinton! LOL! We shall see the campains are just getting started who knows who I will want by the summer!

[heather6773]

I personally like Obama. I have had enough of Mrs. Clinton here in Ny. :toast: I think if he can deliver what he promises than its a step in the right direction. It will never be a perfect world and to think that would be naive on my part but I am hopeful:thumb2:

[Deana]

I still have to do a lot of homework about the candidates but I do know that I want a HUGE change from our current situation.
I went to high school with Fred Thompson's wife (and she was on my dance team) and I want to barf every time I see them!

[Turtleheadfred]

I was gonna ask "which wife" for Thompson!?!? :biglaugh:

I live in Tennessee and around here (whether it's admitted or not) he's known as a big whore-dog! And the women you usually saw him with were T-R-A-M-P-Y looking!

[heather6773]

I was gonna ask "which wife" for Thompson!?!? :biglaugh:

I live in Tennessee and around here (whether it's admitted or not) he's known as a big whore-dog! And the women you usually saw him with were T-R-A-M-P-Y looking!


THF I live in NY and I would refer to him as a MAN WHORE!!!!

[Turtleheadfred]

HAHAHA! :biglaugh: Well, he just looked REALLY silly around here when he was dating Lori Morgan - because she looked like SUCH a hoochie - and here he was 20+ years older than her... Lord, you get the idea!

I said that their relationship was never going to last when he gave her a Bassett Hound and she gave it back "because it smelled bad"! Please! Hounds do have a specific smell, but any woman who doesn't like a puppy - well, THERE YOU GO!

Sorry - I just went off on a tangent there didn't I? :confused:

[Deana]

OMG, hilarious.

Yeah, I went to high school with Jeri Kehn, his current wife. She was pretty fake in HS, guess she has kept that up, lol.

So are there any great websites or anything like that to research candidates? How do you get a fair an unbiased education on the candidates? It hardly seems possible to be able to get good info out there...

[Turtleheadfred]

I know Deana - I haven't decided either and the one thing I DO know is that all the news casts are biased! You just can't believe anything you see, read or hear anymore, which ticks me off. I don't know what happened to the "free press" that was supposed to be unbiased, but I don't know if there is one anymore and we need it!

[Sexy Strawberry]

Well I don't really know much about Obama, but I think I would choose him. I don't like Hilary because I find her rather simple.

As for the Republicans, no comments!

[heather6773]

As for the Republicans, no comments!


That pretty much sums it up for me:clap:

[RedBedHead]

I don't like Hilary because I find her rather simple.

Hilary became a democrat when she married Bill. She's still a bit too conservative for my blood.

[yonksgirl]

That pretty much sums it up for me:clap:

HAHAHA!! Me too! I have a couple of friends that are the "Big R" ....we are always kidding back and forth about it! LOL! No, but seriously none of them trip my trigger.

[meliz]

Dear Mr President...

YouTube - Pink - Dear Mr President Live In Wembley - I'm Not Dead Tour (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q56pHCGrlc4)

[IUgrad02]

Deana, that's crazy that you know her... their age difference creeps me out!!! She went to DePauw University, which is where my hubby went. She just LOOKS fake to me.

I don't know yet who we are for. My family members are all "the big R", so to speak, but I am a little bit here and a little bit there.... We so far have talked about Obama (DH and I). Need to do some more research...

[heather6773]

ok now that we are getting to know more about them anyone have a favorite?

[Deana]

I am pretty sure where my vote is going :) A lot of people in my family are very strong/conservative republicans, so I won't be discussing my candidate choice with them!!!

I am just crossing my fingers that I get to witness the first woman US president elected:) . What an awesome piece of history that could be! I remember being a teenager and saying that I probably won't ever see that happen (and other adults saying the same thing).

[HeavenLeigh]

Unless my mind changes I'll probably vote for Hillary. I have no faith in Obama what-so-ever. I guess I'll have to really review and read up on the republican runners and compare them to Hillary. I do know we are in desperate need of a change and can't wait til Bush hits the trail.

[RedBedHead]

OK guys. Now that it's narrowed down to two and the trash slinging has begun what are you thinking?

[Sexy Strawberry]

I just can't believe McCain exists... although after seeing Bush I can expect everything. I wouldn't be surprised either if Paris Hilton got elected anyway...

[heather6773]

I wouldn't be surprised either if Paris Hilton got elected anyway...

:biglaugh:and Nicole Ritchie her VP?:crazy:I'm staying with Obama!!!

[meliz]

So? What did you think of Obama's speech?

This Canuck was pretty impressed; he's a great orator. Debates should be fun!

[heather6773]

I like listening to him. I cannot stand listening to McCain. Something about him annoys me. I feel like Obama and his team could actually do something for this country. He sort of makes you feel better. People complain he is so young but look at what the older generation has done. Maybe someone younger with new ideas is just what we need...can't get much worse:blah:

[Deana]

I liked what he had to say, and I found the whole DNC pretty inspiring. I think he made a good move in having Biden as his VP. Kind of balances out the "lack of experience" argument.

[RedBedHead]

I thought Obama's speech last night was awesome. He had both my husband and I teary eyed which is REALLY hard to accomplish.
McCain's pick scares me! Palin is ultra conservative. Watching the two of them on stage together at noon today was like watching a train wreck IMO. They both looked horribly uncomfortable.
I can't wait for the debates!

[Sexy Strawberry]

I have to say I like Obama, I don't know much about him but he doesn't seem a bad guy. I also like his wife from what I've seen.
Unfortunately I don't believe much in all these changes. The US foreign politics (which is what worries me) is quite cyclical, you have a horror phase and then a nice guy who makes many people forget.
Anyway, I'm happy that the Republicans are leaving for a while, I totally believe this time they're not winning and also that they don't want to win. I have no words to describe the hate I have for them after all they've done which I definitely won't forget or forgive... even just one week ago according to the UN 90 civilians (60 children) were killed in a US bombing in Afghanistan. Is there anyone out there who stills believe anyone can allow such a crime? Well I'll stop here, you all already know where I stand...

[heather6773]

I am not familiar with McCains choice. I heard something about her being from Alaska but thats about all. Her hair REALLY needs a makeover though....lol...I noticed that first thing.:silly:

[meliz]

Oy. I dare say he chose Palin in an effort to sell "feminist voters" or maybe it was "extreme crazy right rwng voters" he was wooing-- whatever the strategy, I think it will fail on both scores. If *she's* a feminist, I am the queen of England, and you would have to be one stupid feminist to mistake her womanhood with feminism. At the same time, she has two too many ovaries to be a "real" conservative to the die-hard righties that even McCain doesn't do it for.

I really have to think-- what the heck was McCain thinking? 44? Gov less than 2 years? Preggo teen daughter (don't get me wrong-- I totally totally *totally* think that this should never in a gabillion years be am issue, but I highly doubt that the Christian right can let his little issue go.) I also cannot help myself with this JAB: Hey Palin, How did that abstinance teaching you condone work out? No kidding it doesn't work! The science says it doesn't and so does your family tree.

ANYWAY... I am sure she is a fine person. She seems spunky, which I like. And wow, she must be great at multitasking! I also do think it's pretty cool that her hub and kids are Inuit. That's a first, I am sure. Aboriginal first children. That said, there is, IMO, no way on earth you will have a VP Palin. And also IMO, that is a very very very good thing.

[Sexy Strawberry]

Sad that private life is such an issue for US politics... the fact that a politician cheats on his wife or that the politician's teenage daughter is pregnant can be major issues. In Europe even conservative parties are much more modern than that. That's just old-fashioned and behind our time :confused: I will never understand it...

[heather6773]

Sad that private life is such an issue for US politics... the fact that a politician cheats on his wife or that the politician's teenage daughter is pregnant can be major issues. In Europe even conservative parties are much more modern than that. That's just old-fashioned and behind our time :confused: I will never understand it...

Maria unfortantly we run most of our programs here behind the times...don't even get me started on welfare and our education system....:barf:

[meliz]

There are 2 big diffs I notice in Canadian and American politics.

1. Canadian campaigning is not nearly as cut throat. We don't get the attack adds. Ads that are too mean are counterproductive and will backfire.

2. Political families never enter in to it. No Canadian candidate would ever parade his/her family before the media. After the election they might do a photo shoot or something, but that's it. And you know, in the US the media gets all the blame for picking on candidates' families, but I blame the candidates themselves. It was Obama and Palin who paraded their kids before the media, making them fair game. That's just not right... and besides that, it's totally irrelevant to the issues.

[Sexy Strawberry]

Yea Heather, I wonder if people aren't interested in making progress in those fields. What could be more important than education and welfare?

Meliz, that's another "funny" point, how US politicians talk so much about their lives and families... as if it was an important factor for ruling a country. Political campaigns and politicians look like a circus to me, it's all about the show! About delivering moving speeches that are meaningless most of the time. It's a way of distracting people from what really matters.

Personally I admire the way Scandinavian countries work. You pay high taxes, but you just don't have to worry about anything, you have an excellent education, excellent health services and when you retire you don't need to worry about anything. Spain is pretty social too, and in general, compared to the USA, almost any Western European country is social.

[meliz]

Interestingly, did you hear Mitt ('the twit') Romney last night come down on Obama for bringing "European" ideas to the USA? Heheheh. Bad mean sinister Europe, what with their highest quality of life ratings in the world and their frighteningly high life satisfaction ratings.... Heheheh. Scare tactic much?:)

[heather6773]

Interestingly, did you hear Mitt ('the twit') Romney last night come down on Obama for bringing "European" ideas to the USA? Heheheh. Bad mean sinister Europe, what with their highest quality of life ratings in the world and their frighteningly high life satisfaction ratings.... Heheheh. Scare tactic much?:)

:toast:he is a twit...I love how the former candidates blast the ones who actually are doing well. HHMMMMM well they didn't make it did they? I can't stand the whole show of it. I wish they would decide how to fix our country and just do it without a song and dance....

[Time Traveler]

I'd like to jump into this discussion, if I may.. Sorry that I didn't bring any Tea and Crumpets, hehehe.. :type:

The problem that we have in this election are the folks who have abandoned their journalistic principles for sensationalism.

Let me begin by saying that I am not Republican, nor Democrat. I am an Independant Constitutionalist. The secret behind the Constitution that was created by the Founders of these United States, was to limit Government. Three words define their intent,, "We The People"..

How this has come this far without a true evaluation of who Obama is, truly blows my mind. I have read many of your posts that say that you really don't know who Obama is, and that is the most disturbing issue I have with all of the folks that are going to vote for this man.. I am not a fan of Howard Stern, but he did a man on the street interview segment that appears on You Tube..

YouTube - Howard Stern Exposes Clueless Obama Supporters (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vhbH9IYirD0)

I do not associate this panel of intelligent voters with the folks that Howey spoke with, and the questions that he asked, despite the misdirection that is brought to light, just what these people know about what they are doing, by voting for the most powerful position on the face of the planet..

Now,, let's address an issue that you do not hear from the Mainstream media that has to do with the character and integrity of Barak Obama.. I'll start with a resent interview with Joe Biden and an Orlando News Stations reporter, Barbara West.. I hope that ya'll have heard the conversation from an average middle class guy, who is known as Joe the Plumber and Obama, who happened down this Joe's home street, 2 weeks ago. Begin with Joe Biden's dance around the facts that are on record..

YouTube - WFTV Interviews Joe Biden 10/23/08 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TW_wQgWviZ8)

Then there is the conversation with with Joe the Plumber and Barak..

YouTube - Small Business Owner Confronts Obama On Raising His Taxes (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpZLMPoQ8VI)

So here is a statement by Obama that he wants to Share the Wealth.. You may be dazzled by his orations, and he speaks quite well. Hey, he's a Lawyer, as is Joe Biden.. John and Sarah are not..

YouTube - JOE the PLUMBER : Obama says, "I'll Spread The Wealth!" (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwtnPi7hi0U)

His statement that taxes have gone down over the last 8 years.. People, that is a result of the Tax cuts on the Bush plan that brought about a 10 year program of tax cuts,, that the Democrats will eliminate when they have a 60% control of the Congress. Imagine a Full House of the Executive, Legeslative, and the Judicial Branches of Government that believe that they are autonomous within all decisions about our lives, not to mention that most of our so called representatives are multi- millionares..

I'll take my leave for a moment in time as I ask you a question,, to what degree are you willing to give up your Freedoms, and allow an elite group of millionares to dictate how your hard earned money will be distributed..

Obama's proposals cannot pay for his promises,, so who do you think is going to bare the burden of the cost? We The People!!!!

[Time Traveler]

Sad that private life is such an issue for US politics... the fact that a politician cheats on his wife or that the politician's teenage daughter is pregnant can be major issues. In Europe even conservative parties are much more modern than that. That's just old-fashioned and behind our time :confused: I will never understand it...

Perhaps it is a reason that you do not remember that those that came to this land were escaping a type of persecution that had to do with personal freedom.. Puritans founded this Love of Life.. What is it that you do not understand??

Is it so wrong to teach our children that having a physical joining is sacred?? How does the sanctity of Love between a Man and a Woman become a test of how your life might be shared, when you have to try eachother out with an insertion and a feeling of reception? Isn't knowing your lifetime partner more important than a physical act of our animal instincts? Who is the person that you choose, between their ears. Who are they in their thoughts and beliefs? Do you feel as they do in this life? Can you provide for a family in your progression of sharing the Love that you expect to share with another? How would you expect to know your life's Love, if you do not get to know them, ahead of a physical experience?

Being true to your mate is the most important issue in any relationship, and that should be taught to your children..

[Sexy Strawberry]

Perhaps it is a reason that you do not remember that those that came to this land were escaping a type of persecution that had to do with personal freedom.. Puritans founded this Love of Life.. What is it that you do not understand??
I don't remember that? Exactly because of that, it is a contradiction. People who look for freedom live now in a country with no freedom, or better said, with a faked freedom that does not exist.

Is it so wrong to teach our children that having a physical joining is sacred?? How does the sanctity of Love between a Man and a Woman become a test of how your life might be shared, when you have to try eachother out with an insertion and a feeling of reception? Isn't knowing your lifetime partner more important than a physical act of our animal instincts? Who is the person that you choose, between their ears. Who are they in their thoughts and beliefs? Do you feel as they do in this life? Can you provide for a family in your progression of sharing the Love that you expect to share with another? How would you expect to know your life's Love, if you do not get to know them, ahead of a physical experience?

Being true to your mate is the most important issue in any relationship, and that should be taught to your children..[/COLOR]

Ehhh, we are talking about two different things.

NOBODY said you can't teach those things to your children. What you consider your values, is up to you. I was talking about politics.

I don't know for you, but for me politicians are NOT my spiritual guides. Politics combined with religion make me shudder, remind me of Absolutism, something that we got rid off a long time ago here.

The worst of this is the hypocresy. Someone who is in favor of killing innocents based on lies isn't the one indicated to tell us what is moral and what is not.

"Funny" that some of your citizens worry so much about homosexuals and cheating and so on and don't give a damn about what your government is doing to your young generation, sending them to a war. Not to mention the innocents dying in Iraq, which obviously 90% of the people who NOW are against the war don't give a damn for.

PS: No offense but I'm still wondering if your post was for real or if you were kidding.

[Time Traveler]

Sorry.. We really crossed paths in what I was trying to say. I apologize for not making myself clear.

This is what I was trying to say with regard to what you had said from the quote below. Yes, it is sad with reference to the injection of a Politician's children's actions into who the Parent is as the representative, who seeks election, is wrong,, it shows the humanity of every family and those issues should be left to the family as a private issue, but it is another thing to disregard the fidelity of the person that is either in office, or running for office..

Sad that private life is such an issue for US politics... the fact that a politician cheats on his wife or that the politician's teenage daughter is pregnant can be major issues.

The idea that we are behind the rest of the world, by having higher expectations of our representatives and Political Leaders, is founded by the principles of our beginnings. Our representatives and their personal indescretions speak to their character. If they would betray their vows to their Husband or Wife, how can you Trust them to stand next to the Oath they would take for Our Country?

The point that I tried to make, was holding the candidate accountable to speaking and being True to their word. Fast fingers don't always permit the thought to come across clearly.

I Trust John McCain and Sarah Palin to speak more Truths than I do Obama or Biden...

[meliz]

TT you are as independent as Bill Clinton or Colin Powell!

I would also argue that *anyone* who thinks Obama is a socialist has no clue about what socialism is. The ignorance of North Americans is astounding. "Friends" it ain't about tax rates! West's question on that was as stupid as it was inflamatory. I woulda laughed at it and her too [and I am a very polite person!] Journalists should educate themselves before they go asking leading and uninformed questions. Biden gave her just what she and her ignorance deserve. C'mon, Barb, you need to do better than that!

Um, also, read up on the Puritans. They were indeed opressed religious dissenters who sought "freedom" in NA. Too bad they didn't practice what they preached. Ever hear of the a little thing called the colonial Indian wars? Not great freedom promoters, them Purtians. Hint: Hagioagraphy never makes for good moral lessons. Puritans were not very good "Americans" it turns out. Any history book written after, oh, 1950, should give you a pretty good sense of that.

"Being true to your mate is the most important issue in any relationship, and that should be taught to your children.."
OK.. [unless your mate wacks you around or something, of course... and then that lesson to your kids is decidedly dangerous] but this has to do with politics, in what way? Personally I don't care what my national leader does in his/her bedroom and with whom; and I don't care if he/she is a nice person, or attends church or any of that PRIVATE stuff. That leader instead needs to know how to manage a nation's affairs and have the know-how to deal with crises. I laughed when I watched the Obama-mercial and saw him yammering on about his family values- I don't care! It's sad though, that he feels he has to play that game. And smart too, I guess, given the shocking numbers who look to their politcal leaders as moral guideposts. Scario.

So Oabama is going to run the economy into the ground, hunh? Hmm... too bad its already been run into the ground! Maybe you're right and you should all vote to give the GOP "one more shot"- it's not like they have wracked up the highest deficient ever or anything, not like they have gotten you stuck in a multi-trillion dollar war that cannot be won, and not like they have allowed Wall St. fat-cats to screw Americans out of their economic futures. You're absolutely right- give 'em another kick at the can. What can it hurt?

ETA: "I Trust John McCain and Sarah Palin to speak more Truths than I do Obama or Biden"
Seriously?? They have run the nastiest, dirtiest campaign of untruths ever! John McCain has reinvented himself totally. Four years ago he believed that women have the right to choose- now, the opposite. The man has sold his soul and his ideals down the river to appease the conservative base. And you believe a word he says, now? You trust a chameleon? I don't get it. Also, how do you deal with his philanderin' with the ladies? God help anyone who models their moral behaviour after this piggy-piggy.

As for Palin- oy boy. She thinks the earth is 6000 years old! I just can't get past this. :) PLUS she was pegged by a bipartisan commission for being UNETHICAL. And you think she is full o' the truth? How on [this 6000 year old] earth? Is it because she drops her "g"s? That folksy crap win you over? It's the winks isn't it! Do you think she is winking at you?:) BTW, is this what you mean by being "independent"? :)

[Time Traveler]

"Funny" that some of your citizens worry so much about homosexuals and cheating and so on and don't give a damn about what your government is doing to your young generation, sending them to a war. Not to mention the innocents dying in Iraq, which obviously 90% of the people who NOW are against the war don't give a damn for.


There in your own words is a blatant misunderstanding of what the world faces in these days of complete acceptance. Verse yourself upon how this all began. The Ottoman Empire came pretty close to taking over Europe which became the Persian Empire, who tried it again, and they were defeated then, and we are fighting them now.. This War did not begin with the United States of America,, These people have been on the attack against Eastern Europe for centuries..

It took September 11th, 2001, for our country to take action, and by the way, are you aware that we have not incorporated the Draft for our Soldiers? 80% of our Hero's in uniform are re-enlisting to fight these people, again, who strap bombs to their bodies, and drive vehicles, laced with heavy explosives, to kill us.

If you have forgotten, we fight for our Freedom, as you call our Faked Freedom.. If you believe what you have is faked, then you have not seen first hand, the worlds that live under oppression.. The struggle they endure is beyond your imagination, and they accept it because it is all they know.

Take a peek at the world stock market and how our actions reflect upon the entire planet..

If the United States of America falls today,, who will be the benefactor of Our World. We have begun a systematic progression of sharing the Freedom that we have come to take for granted,, by our children,, or just a few..

When the excrement hits the fan, who is going to go to bat for your Lives??Are you willing to hold a gun to your infiltrators, to preserve your Faked Freedom?

I am not an extremist. I have educated myself about the options and I have traveled the world and seen how other people live..

[Time Traveler]

TT you are as independent as Bill Clinton or Colin Powell!

I would also argue that *anyone* who thinks Obama is a socialist has no clue about what socialism is. The ignorance of North Americans is astounding. "Friends" it ain't about tax rates! West's question on that was as stupid as it was inflamatory. I woulda laughed at it and her too [and I am a very polite person!] Journalists should educate themselves before they go asking leading and uninformed questions. Biden gave her just what she and her ignorance deserve. C'mon, Barb, you need to do better than that!

Um, also, read up on the Puritans. They were indeed opressed religious dissenters who sought "freedom" in NA. Too bad they didn't practice what they preached. Ever hear of the a little thing called the colonial Indian wars? Not great freedom promoters, them Purtians. Hint: Hagioagraphy never makes for good moral lessons. Puritans were not very good "Americans" it turns out. Any history book written after, oh, 1950, should give you a pretty good sense of that.

"Being true to your mate is the most important issue in any relationship, and that should be taught to your children.."
OK.. [unless your mate wacks you around or something, of course... and then that lesson to your kids is decidedly dangerous] but this has to do with politics, in what way? Personally I don't care what my national leader does in his/her bedroom and with whom; and I don't care if he/she is a nice person, or attends church or any of that PRIVATE stuff. That leader instead needs to know how to manage a nation's affairs and have the know-how to deal with crises. I laughed when I watched the Obama-mercial and saw him yammering on about his family values- I don't care! It's sad though, that he feels he has to play that game. And smart too, I guess, given the shocking numbers who look to their politcal leaders as moral guideposts. Scario.

So Oabama is going to run the economy into the ground, hunh? Hmm... too bad its already been run into the ground! Maybe you're right and you should all vote to give the GOP "one more shot"- it's not like they have wracked up the highest deficient ever or anything, not like they have gotten you stuck in a multi-trillion dollar war that cannot be won, and not like they have allowed Wall St. fat-cats to screw Americans out of their economic futures. You're absolutely right- give 'em another kick at the can. What can it hurt?

ETA: "I Trust John McCain and Sarah Palin to speak more Truths than I do Obama or Biden"
Seriously?? They have run the nastiest, dirtiest campaign of untruths ever! John McCain has reinvented himself totally. Four years ago he believed that women have the right to choose- now, the opposite. The man has sold his soul and his ideals down the river to appease the conservative base. And you believe a word he says, now? You trust a chameleon? I don't get it. Also, how do you deal with his philanderin' with the ladies? God help anyone who models their moral behaviour after this piggy-piggy.

As for Palin- oy boy. She thinks the earth is 6000 years old! I just can't get past this. :) PLUS she was pegged by a bipartisan commission for being UNETHICAL. And you think she is full o' the truth? How on [this 6000 year old] earth? Is it because she drops her "g"s? That folksy crap win you over? It's the winks isn't it! Do you think she is winking at you?:) BTW, is this what you mean by being "independent"? :)

WOW,, Ya'll have become so far detatched from any sort of reality that I cannot continue this education..

Welcome to your World.. Bye babies..:cry:

[meliz]

Uh, OK. All I was doin' was debating... which is one of my favourite pass times (ask anyone!:)). I guess as an educated and informed woman with a keen interest in the fate of the world we all share, I feel I don't the need to be "educated" by someone, especially someone who is so clearly partisan; I'm much more comfortable with actively working my mind in the free exchange of ideas- even when they are disagreeable. I mean, I knew you'd disagree with me, as you are so obviously a staunch Republican and I am so obviously not, but I didn't expect you'd take your toys home! Sorry if I offended you by disagreeing with every single word you said. Obviously, I was thinking that you too appreciated the free exchange of ideas- but I guess you are more a "my way or the highway" kinda gal/guy. Maybe chat boards are not for you as they tend to promote discussion... a blog might be better suited to give you a forum for your personal views?

Anyhoo, if you are American, best of luck on the 4th; I hope you find the independent candidate who suits your needs. McCain, maybe? :) Ya might be wasting your vote, however.;)

[Sexy Strawberry]

There in your own words is a blatant misunderstanding of what the world faces in these days of complete acceptance. Verse yourself upon how this all began. The Ottoman Empire came pretty close to taking over Europe which became the Persian Empire, who tried it again, and they were defeated then, and we are fighting them now.. This War did not begin with the United States of America,, These people have been on the attack against Eastern Europe for centuries..
LOL wait wait wait, you're telling me that what your country is now fighting the embers of the Ottoman Empire??? Ask your president Bush about the Ottoman Empire, he'll ask you if that's a cereal brand or a new fast food chain :D
:biglaugh: Thanks! You gave me the best laugh of the day!!! I won't refute your argument, I will do as if this was meant to be a joke :evil:

It took September 11th, 2001, for our country to take action, and by the way, are you aware that we have not incorporated the Draft for our Soldiers? 80% of our Hero's in uniform are re-enlisting to fight these people, again, who strap bombs to their bodies, and drive vehicles, laced with heavy explosives, to kill us.

If you have forgotten, we fight for our Freedom, as you call our Faked Freedom.. If you believe what you have is faked, then you have not seen first hand, the worlds that live under oppression.. The struggle they endure is beyond your imagination, and they accept it because it is all they know.
This one is not so funny. September 11 (assuming it was not a CIA action) has nothing to do with Iraq my dear. Wake up. Heroes in uniform... they're not heroes, they're victims of your government.
And those people who drive vehicles laced with heavy explosives to kill you are a resistence against an invading force. You are in THEIR country, if you don't want to be killed, leave. Otherwise, let them keep fighting against the invader.

Take a peek at the world stock market and how our actions reflect upon the entire planet..

If the United States of America falls today,, who will be the benefactor of Our World. We have begun a systematic progression of sharing the Freedom that we have come to take for granted,, by our children,, or just a few..

When the excrement hits the fan, who is going to go to bat for your Lives??Are you willing to hold a gun to your infiltrators, to preserve your Faked Freedom?

I am not an extremist. I have educated myself about the options and I have traveled the world and seen how other people live..
Benefactors... LOL!!!!!!
Yes, yes, you are definitely an extremist.
Talking about economics, your country has contributed to the economic crisis we have nowadays. Your capitalism has proved itself wrong, finally. You don't invest in education, you waste your money on weapons. A high rate of US population has no clue where their country lies in a world map, and you are the benefactors of the world? Your president has starred some of the most ignorant statements... Your popularity from a foreign point of view is at its lowest point. Ask an average European about their view on your politics. You'll feel ashamed.
Now, you are definitely kidding me.

[Turtleheadfred]

You guys are doing such a good job debating - I'm not even going to attempt to participate.

I will post this little link - test for anyone who's interested. Obviously this isn't intended to "choose" a candidate for anyone. But what it does do, if anyone is interested, is ask you questions without your knowing what candidate stands for what... just your own personal opinion on various relevant topics. Then, it will let you see how you "score" (so to speak) in relation to the candidates we have to choose from based on social, economic, etc.

Again, this isn't meant to pick a candidate, but if you're not sure - it helps you see where you line up on specific issues... Happy Voting!

ABC News: Match-o-Matic 2 (http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/MatchOMatic/fullpage?id=5542139)

[Time Traveler]

Why does the Main Stream Media not inquire about Obama's past?? Notice that he has not produced any documents about his birth place.

He started his political life in the Home of William Ayers, ever hear about this person? Have you ever studied the politics of Chicago? Mayor Daley or the Chicago Mob? Would you associate yourself with another that surrounded themselves with criminals or those that allied themselves with corruption.. Nothing has been asked of Obama by the main stream media that might tackle his past.. Why has he not been examined by all of the journalists in the Media??

Do you know that Obama would not be able to get a Security Clearance if he applied to the FBI or the CIA, because of his associations?

Reap what you sow,,

[meliz]

Why does the Main Stream Media not inquire about Obama's past?? Notice that he has not produced any documents about his birth place.

Hunh? I watched a bio of him produced by CNN this past weekend (mainstream enough?). He was born in Hawaii, to a Black Kenyan and a white Chicago-ite. His dad abandoned him, his grandparents raised him. What, pray tell, would you like, specifically? I am thinking his record, past and present, is the most scrutinized ever. In case you have not noticed, some of them Reps are a nasty bunch who will pounce on anything. Palin has even been calling this tactic fair game this past week, and getting obnoxious whoops and booos from her "crowds." If the Reps could find anything they could spin, you know Palin would be up there doing it with a wink and a "you betcha."

"He started his political life in the Home of William Ayers, ever hear about this person?"

I have indeed heard of Ayers (as I do not live under a rock:)) and I am well aware of his war-time activism and connection to people who planted bombs back in the 1960s (when the man was in his 20s). It is significant to note, however, that Ayers was never found guilty and is far, far, far more significant still, to note that Obama has said clearly that he vehemently opposes the "domestic terrorism" in which the group linked to Ayers was involved 40+ years ago. Obama was not an associate of his back in the 1960s- that is important to note. And you know what is way more troubling to me? That Palin herself just last week refused to call abortion office bombers "terrorists." Melissa McEwan: If Bill Ayers is a terrorist, why aren't abortion clinic bombers? | Comment is free | guardian.co.uk (http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/cifamerica/2008/oct/29/sarah-palin-abortion-terrorism-ayers)
I guess they are freedom fighters doing "God's Will" ;) Scares me.

I have to add too, also, (:-)) that I am also abundantly aware that profs work with profs with whom they have major ideological differences, and do so all the time. Collaboration on certain issues does not mean the condoning of others. And this does not make a colleague culpable for the ideology of the other. I too, am a "radical prof" (thanks, Palin, for finally making me sound cool!) and have worked with people from all places on the political spectrum. Some are anarchists, some are atheists, some are die-hard conservatives, some are uber Christians. What does that make me? An associate who does not share their ideologies but who is quite capable of working with them on other things. In the real world people can have associates and not share their ideologies. Obama has unequivocally disavowed the type of 1960s violence that Ayers has been linked to. I am sure that McCain himself has worked with people whose ideas are bombastic- does this make McCain guilty of holding the same views? I hope your answer is no, because if it isn't you may fear that your would-be president shares the exact same ideals as G Gordon Libby (convicted felon)! I am not saying he does- I do not think he does- my point is that the "association game" is unfair and unfounded. Do all Republicans, for example, get tarred with the "Storm Thurman" brush? No, because (except at election time) any sane person will acknowledge that one's associates do not define one's values or ideals. I am sure Palin will continue to stump on this today- but what else can we expect from such an ethics violator par excellence? She is as corrupt as the day is long. I find her hypocrisy sickening.

"Have you ever studied the politics of Chicago? Mayor Daley or the Chicago Mob? Would you associate yourself with another that surrounded themselves with criminals or those that allied themselves with corruption.."
No idea what you are alluding to here... but see above re: my feelings on "associates". Maybe you mean Obama's connection to the slum landlord? I was on the phone during this bit and did not quite follow it, but the CNN bio did feature it, and sought Obama's response to allegations that he had dealings with some thuggish landlord.

"Nothing has been asked of Obama by the main stream media that might tackle his past.. Why has he not been examined by all of the journalists in the Media??"
You tell me? Palin said yesterday that such explorations and innuendo are fair game -- there is certainly an audience for a critical media. I personally think the US media is doing a pretty good job in this one. I really feel that this whining mantra about the "Liberal Media" is such BS. There is ALOT of un-liberal media out there too- Fox, for example, but also a whole host of radio shows. That said, I, for one, hope that Sarah Palin keeps up her whining attack on the mainstream media. The less she talks about the economy- the thing Americans really are interested in- and the more she yangs on about the media and fabricates slights on Obama, the more people will be fed up with her- and boy she is racking up a huge disapproval rating! Did you see that poll from yesterday? Hahahaha. She will be pegged as the cause of the Rep loss. For sure. Obama hardly has to do a thing with her on his side. Hahaha.

"Do you know that Obama would not be able to get a Security Clearance if he applied to the FBI or the CIA, because of his associations?"
I entirely do not believe this. As in none of it. I believe that this is a flat out lie. And you, an internet blogger, know this "for a fact" because? I would like to see your source for this. No offense- but I don't believe you. This is, I believe, totally false.

"Reap what you sow,,"
Hahaha. You need not worry. I cannot sow or reap a thing, not in this political fight. But I will be looking from my perch here above the 49th parallel. Me and my radical prof friends are having an election party- and you know who we are rooting for. (Hint: the snacks are blue appetizers and blue drinks:)) I will be donning my shirt that reads (in total, TOTAL jest) "Feminists 4 Palin" and it will be a gay ole time.

[Time Traveler]

Your disection of what I am saying is without substance.. You have not proven me wrong on any issue, and today you can hear Obama saying that our coal industry will go bankrupt if they try to build any new plants for development because his plan for cap and trade will be the most agressive of anything we have seen..

Experience? From His mouth to your ears..

Gateway Pundit: Barack Obama Says He Is Not Experienced Enough to Be President (Video) (http://gatewaypundit.blogspot.com/2008/06/barack-obama-says-he-is-not-experienced.html)

Sorry, that was just a year before he began this farce.. I love your polls as liberals are more likely to respond to superficial questions about the candidates..

Has the media spoken to who this person is? Hard questions? The faces of change have been pretty ugly during the interviews from those that are supporting Obama..

Follow the Pied Piper over the hill, Meliz..

[Time Traveler]

"Do you know that Obama would not be able to get a Security Clearance if he applied to the FBI or the CIA, because of his associations?"

I entirely do not believe this. As in none of it. I believe that this is a flat out lie. And you, an internet blogger, know this "for a fact" because? I would like to see your source for this. No offense- but I don't believe you. This is, I believe, totally false.

You are so uninformed that I only play with your ignorance like a cat plays with a lizard..

I have a TSSI from my service to our country.. I am not an internet blogger!! I am a person that believes in the constitution and I will point fingers at those that wish to undermine our institutions of progression and Truth..

Let me state Barak Hussein Obama's associations,, 20 years with his church,, Rev. Wright.. G-d Damn America from the pulpit.. Father Flaiger who speaks of the same.. William Ayers who did not do time because of a technicality within our system, but his wife, Bernadine Dorn, spent time in Federal prision,, and Obama launched his political career in the home of these folks..

His words that speak to the people of California in one way, privately, and with another precpective, loves.. Never have I seen a lie that presents itself in such a flagrant manner..

There is so much more with so little time.. You like income taxes?? An Obama Administration will not work...:dunce:

[meliz]

I have no idea what much of that means. Seriously, TT. No idea. Liberals respond to more flippant polls? Don't follow you there.

Wanna talk about hard questions? Try: What newspapers do you read? Hahaha. Sorry, can't help myself. But c'mon- the Wasilla Press, wouldn't that have been an easy paper to name that would scored points? This *still* cracks me up.

Three years ago Obama may well have thought he was not experienced enough; fair enough. I respect someone with that much self-reflection. Ask him that same question today- you'll get a different answer for sure. What would make his answer of three years ago more accurate than his answer today? Your bias?

I would also suggest that if the candidates' ability to put together a campaign and reach "you the people" is a test of leadership ability, he sure has learned alot in the last three years.

If I were you I also would not get my knickers in a knot ... yet. Your boy McCain might "win" yet. Do I think that Obama will win if the vote is run fairly? For sure. This is a new thought for me. Until recently I actually felt that Americans would be too racist to vote for a black man when push came to shove and that in the privacy of the voting booth they might back out and vote for the type of change a 73 year old white guy can bring. I am not so sure of this anymore. I think people are more past "race" than I thought. I sure hope so.

That said, I DO think that the real possibility exists for electronic voting fraud. Your e-voting systems are grossly undertested and, shock surprise given that a lead manufacturer of them is a staunch Republican, when they screw up they tend to err on the side of McCain. Quel coinkydink! This whole paperless system is innane. I hope it doesn't cost you guys democracy (again?). On the upside (for you), if Democracy is lost, a Republican presidency will be retained.

Happy voting and election-watching!

PS: Yes, I do very much appreciate income tax- and we pay alot up here, trust me. They mean my 75 year old mother does not need to worry about being destitute if she gets sick. They mean that moms (and/or dads) get a full year off work on the births their babies. They mean that university (though still too expensive) is at least somewhat accessible to everyone. Well worth every single penny. I'd pay more to improve educ and health care too.

PPS: Nice use of the tactic of the dimwitted- referring to Obama's middle name. Spare me.

[meliz]

In the interest of fairness: a second panel has determined that Palin did not violate the ethics code. Mind you this is the panel she appointed, so take it for what it is- a titch on the biased side, versus the independent first panel.

Palin didn't violate ethics law, 2nd probe finds - CNN.com (http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/11/03/palin.investigation/index.html)

The difference between the two rests in the interpretation of the law, not in a different interpretation of what Palin herself did.